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  #1  
Old 23/02/2010, 06:27 AM
abeille abeille is offline
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Default INFP in love with a INTP

Hello!

I need a little help warning, this is going to be long...

I have a very good friend, I've known him since we were 17. I am an INFP and he's an INTP. When we were in high school, we were best friends. He told me he was in love with me as soon as I was single. But I didn't return the feelings at the time and met my now husband at the same time. We remained friends for about a year and lost touch when I got married. That was 8 years ago.

We've reconnected in the last few months and I've realized I am in love with him. I am still with my husband, but we are in the process separating/divorcing (I began this process of leaving my husband months before I reconnected with my INTP friend, he has nothing to do with the split).

The problem is that he sends off mixed signals. We will meet, and everytime we meet we have deep conversations about everything and anything, we have a lot in common and both enjoy intelligent conversations. He's also made it very clear that he thinks I'm beautiful, on many occasions. If we accidentally touch, he won't move away. Anytime we meet, he seems to be extremely into me.

But, I am often the one making the first steps, contacting him first and getting him to come meet me. He has invited me out a few times, but 75% of the time, it's me making the first moves. When we meet, he's often the first one to leave. If we have a moment where things seem to be moving toward a romantic relation, he'll play hermit for a few days after that. But he always comes back and always seems even more into me than before. There seems to be some sort of battle going on inside of him.

I can't quite read him. Is this normal INTP behavior? Is he only acting this way because I am not yet divorced? He is a very sensitive guy and not at all a "player". Should I wait for him to make a move? Or do I make a move? If I make a move, how do I let him know how I feel? I don't want to ruin this friendship.

Sorry, this is a lot of questions... Thanks to everyone who answers.
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Old 06/04/2010, 09:34 AM
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Having recently gone through the mating dance with an awesome INFp, I am going to answer your questions by, yes, engaging in outright projection. With the aim of making more sense and avoiding repetition, I'll also re-order the sequence of some Q&A pairs:

Quote:
The problem is that he sends off mixed signals...There seems to be some sort of battle going on inside of him.
He's applying habitual, detailed rationality (his strong point) to unaccustomed, raw emotions (his weak point), scrutinizing them top to bottom for their origins and validity. He's also rating his chances of success/happiness with you by comparing his internal findings with external realities. In decision-making, rational people usually favor impersonal facts over personal impressions, sometimes mistrusting or even disdaining their feelings. So, his mixed-uppedness is from friction caused by using cold and calculating logic to understand, control, and act on hot-blooded instincts.

Quote:
We will meet, and everytime we meet we have deep conversations about everything and anything, we have a lot in common and both enjoy intelligent conversations. He's also made it very clear that he thinks I'm beautiful, on many occasions.
Congrats! Unlike many INT-types it sounds like he falls outside the autism spectrum. :) From my own experience with amore I'll bet he's intensely impressed and curious about you on several levels, probably pinching himself and taking pains not to screw up.

Quote:
If we have a moment where things seem to be moving toward a romantic relation, he'll play hermit for a few days after that. But he always comes back and always seems even more into me than before.
He's stepping away to make sense of his attraction to you and deciding whether/how to proceed along all the possible pathways his mind presents to itself. If he's taken as great a shine to you as I did my INFp you are in all likelihood blowing his mind right now, so he needs time alone to collect himself and perhaps even practice conversations and gestures in his head, preparing for (creating) future opportunities to express them as clearly and fully as possible.

Quote:
Is he only acting this way because I am not yet divorced?
I'd wager he'd rather see that complication resolved before committing himself because...

Quote:
I can't quite read him.
...he might be more comfortable demonstrating his affection for you than verbalizing it. If that's so and you're still married then his opportunities to bring you food, notes, drawings, music, gifts, offers of household help, adult funtimes, etc. etc. etc. are compromised. Rationals like INTps usually look for a partner in a mate, so your hubby probably looks like an obstacle to realizing that. I myself have few requirements from a girlfriend except that she respect my wish for reciprocity and exclusivity in our relationship, and your friend might be like-minded.

If you want him to open up I suggest finding a quiet place and just asking him about what's puzzling you. He might squirm a bit but he'll respond well to patient directness, especially if you start with broad questions and then fill in the blanks. Also, since his thoughts are probably complex, wide ranging, and intertwined he'll appreciate having a starting point to explain himself instead of trying to birth some giant idea on the spot.

Quote:
Is this normal INTP behavior?
From my reading and personal experience it seems true to type.

Quote:
Should I wait for him to make a move?
No! He might sit and spin forever without outside encouragement.

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Or do I make a move?
Yes! The more concrete information he has the more comfortable he'll feel making decisions.

Quote:
If I make a move, how do I let him know how I feel?
See above. If all else fails, a good old fashioned lip-lock is pretty tough to misunderstand.

Quote:
I don't want to ruin this friendship.
It sounds like you two have gotten very lucky and will hopefully work together to stay that way. Best of luck!
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  #3  
Old 06/04/2010, 10:29 AM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Having recently gone through the mating dance with an awesome INFp, I am going to answer your questions by, yes, engaging in outright projection. With the aim of making more sense and avoiding repetition, I'll also re-order the sequence of some Q&A pairs:
Brilliant!

Quote:
Congrats! Unlike many INT-types it sounds like he falls outside the autism spectrum.
AHAHAHAHHAHA!


Quote:
See above. If all else fails, a good old fashioned lip-lock is pretty tough to misunderstand.
lol! I am going to start thinking of myself as old fashioned guy.

-------------------------------------

Although not related to the thread, I couldn't resist posting..and asking, so....may I ask, what type are you, surely not INTp?
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  #4  
Old 06/04/2010, 07:31 PM
ENTroP ENTroP is offline
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Originally Posted by abeille View Post
Hello!

I need a little help warning, this is going to be long...

I have a very good friend, I've known him since we were 17. I am an INFP and he's an INTP. When we were in high school, we were best friends. He told me he was in love with me as soon as I was single. But I didn't return the feelings at the time and met my now husband at the same time. We remained friends for about a year and lost touch when I got married. That was 8 years ago.

We've reconnected in the last few months and I've realized I am in love with him. I am still with my husband, but we are in the process separating/divorcing (I began this process of leaving my husband months before I reconnected with my INTP friend, he has nothing to do with the split).

The problem is that he sends off mixed signals. We will meet, and everytime we meet we have deep conversations about everything and anything, we have a lot in common and both enjoy intelligent conversations. He's also made it very clear that he thinks I'm beautiful, on many occasions. If we accidentally touch, he won't move away. Anytime we meet, he seems to be extremely into me.

But, I am often the one making the first steps, contacting him first and getting him to come meet me. He has invited me out a few times, but 75% of the time, it's me making the first moves. When we meet, he's often the first one to leave. If we have a moment where things seem to be moving toward a romantic relation, he'll play hermit for a few days after that. But he always comes back and always seems even more into me than before. There seems to be some sort of battle going on inside of him.

I can't quite read him. Is this normal INTP behavior? Is he only acting this way because I am not yet divorced? He is a very sensitive guy and not at all a "player". Should I wait for him to make a move? Or do I make a move? If I make a move, how do I let him know how I feel? I don't want to ruin this friendship.

Sorry, this is a lot of questions... Thanks to everyone who answers.
My take is that he is shy, and unsure of himself. Try kissing him.
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  #5  
Old 06/04/2010, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
what type are you, surely not INTp?
Does my lack of apparent interest in LARPing, Star Trek, or Linux make me seem atypical?

Every Myers-Briggs or socionics test I've taken over the years has returned an INTp result, scoring roughly 40-60-90-60% each time. However, I find much of myself in the MBTI INTJ and I also have a socionics j-p ambiguity, so INTx is an apt label. The usually-p-to-sometimes-j switch occurs mostly when my core values are seriously challenged, or when a more rigid, decisive mien is required to deal with immediate existential threats. Once the conflict is resolved I return to reading 1000 page books by long-dead authors, ignoring my housemates' requests that I play guitar less than 4-8 hours per day, writing prolix crap on web forums, and letting the dirty clothes and dishes pile up.

Something I've noted is that fans/students of these profiling systems often fall prey to their own type's hype. Many forget that the mind is naturally dynamic, multi-modal, and malleable. We all use the full range of E-I/N-S/F-T/J-P functions in varying degrees. MB/Kiersey/socionics tests merely reveal which of those functions we habitually favor; they do not claim that we possess or use any of them to the exclusion of the others. So, though they may be scrupulously suppressed, hidden, and analyzed to pieces, an INTp's feelings are very much present and possibly quite deep, whether (s)he wants to admit it or not.

Hopefully I've stereotypically over-explained to your satisfaction.
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Old 07/04/2010, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Does my lack of apparent interest in LARPing, Star Trek, or Linux make me seem atypical?

Every Myers-Briggs or socionics test I've taken over the years has returned an INTp result, scoring roughly 40-60-90-60% each time. However, I find much of myself in the MBTI INTJ and I also have a socionics j-p ambiguity, so INTx is an apt label. The usually-p-to-sometimes-j switch occurs mostly when my core values are seriously challenged, or when a more rigid, decisive mien is required to deal with immediate existential threats. Once the conflict is resolved I return to reading 1000 page books by long-dead authors, ignoring my housemates' requests that I play guitar less than 4-8 hours per day, writing prolix crap on web forums, and letting the dirty clothes and dishes pile up.

Something I've noted is that fans/students of these profiling systems often fall prey to their own type's hype. Many forget that the mind is naturally dynamic, multi-modal, and malleable. We all use the full range of E-I/N-S/F-T/J-P functions in varying degrees. MB/Kiersey/socionics tests merely reveal which of those functions we habitually favor; they do not claim that we possess or use any of them to the exclusion of the others. So, though they may be scrupulously suppressed, hidden, and analyzed to pieces, an INTp's feelings are very much present and possibly quite deep, whether (s)he wants to admit it or not.

Hopefully I've stereotypically over-explained to your satisfaction.
ILI FTW....
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Increased expression of one function (1) suppresses the opposing intradichotomy function and (2) suppresses the opposing intrablock function (and vise versa).
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Old 07/04/2010, 09:01 AM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Does my lack of apparent interest in LARPing, Star Trek, or Linux make me seem atypical?

Every Myers-Briggs or socionics test I've taken over the years has returned an INTp result, scoring roughly 40-60-90-60% each time. However, I find much of myself in the MBTI INTJ and I also have a socionics j-p ambiguity, so INTx is an apt label. The usually-p-to-sometimes-j switch occurs mostly when my core values are seriously challenged, or when a more rigid, decisive mien is required to deal with immediate existential threats. Once the conflict is resolved I return to reading 1000 page books by long-dead authors, ignoring my housemates' requests that I play guitar less than 4-8 hours per day, writing prolix crap on web forums, and letting the dirty clothes and dishes pile up.

Something I've noted is that fans/students of these profiling systems often fall prey to their own type's hype. Many forget that the mind is naturally dynamic, multi-modal, and malleable. We all use the full range of E-I/N-S/F-T/J-P functions in varying degrees. MB/Kiersey/socionics tests merely reveal which of those functions we habitually favor; they do not claim that we possess or use any of them to the exclusion of the others. So, though they may be scrupulously suppressed, hidden, and analyzed to pieces, an INTp's feelings are very much present and possibly quite deep, whether (s)he wants to admit it or not.

Hopefully I've stereotypically over-explained to your satisfaction.
I could have sworn you were NeFi, [your first post reminded me of pandapanda, an old poster here who is ENFp, who may want to check her out if you are bored or interested or smething], your style of reasoning didn't seem atypical of INTp's in your first post, and by that I mean reasoning of NiTe ego.

You understand people and yourself a bit too well imo for an INTp...however, if you are one, perhaps you are just a bit more developed.

Oh, the above post, yeah I agree.

It's not so much your lack of interest in star trek, it's more your understanding of the human side of people, you're ability to push things (engaging in good old fashioned lip lock) - could even indicate E, being able to laugh at yourself in the manner you did (INTx's are autistic), and your pleasantness in wishing them both good luck! (INTp's often apply caution).

Oh, these points each on their own aren't great, the way I look at these things is to take them in their overall - the whole picture it presents rather than just isolated snap-shots, which is also what I thought about what you wrote.

Either way, you are interesting person imo! I hope you post more on the forums! (Oh, and if you say you are INTp I accept it, I mean no offense by what I said, I was simply curious, it's a compliment in a way).
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Old 07/04/2010, 10:35 AM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Does my lack of apparent interest in LARPing, Star Trek, or Linux make me seem atypical?

Every Myers-Briggs or socionics test I've taken over the years has returned an INTp result, scoring roughly 40-60-90-60% each time. However, I find much of myself in the MBTI INTJ and I also have a socionics j-p ambiguity, so INTx is an apt label. The usually-p-to-sometimes-j switch occurs mostly when my core values are seriously challenged, or when a more rigid, decisive mien is required to deal with immediate existential threats. Once the conflict is resolved I return to reading 1000 page books by long-dead authors, ignoring my housemates' requests that I play guitar less than 4-8 hours per day, writing prolix crap on web forums, and letting the dirty clothes and dishes pile up.
Let's say you type as an I on these tests because you are classed as a bit too reserved to be in the E dichotomy. You see yourself as quite a logical person so you score T. Indeed, you're interest in reading 1000 page books could just well be a sign of a high influence on Te HA. So what happens, an ENFp who's somewhat reserved, likes to think of themself as logical, they score I and T, they are still N, viola, INTP test result! It's easy!

Quote:
Something I've noted is that fans/students of these profiling systems often fall prey to their own type's hype. Many forget that the mind is naturally dynamic, multi-modal, and malleable. We all use the full range of E-I/N-S/F-T/J-P functions in varying degrees. MB/Kiersey/socionics tests merely reveal which of those functions we habitually favor; they do not claim that we possess or use any of them to the exclusion of the others. So, though they may be scrupulously suppressed, hidden, and analyzed to pieces, an INTp's feelings are very much present and possibly quite deep, whether (s)he wants to admit it or not.

Hopefully I've stereotypically over-explained to your satisfaction.
INTp's certainly do have feelings, they are normally even less inclined to admit them than ISTp's who are so often big softies on the inside.

Perhaps you are female so that helps you be more in touch with your emotions.

I'm not wanting to split your words unecessarily, but it's maybe worth noting that the E/I N/S, T/F etc are actually dichotomies, not functions. Functions are Si, Se, Ne etc.

Edit: You might even be ISTp. You remind me of iannau in the sense of your intellectualism, she was also typed INTp incorrectly on MB type tests.

Here, have a look at what your HA is

http://www.socionics.com/articles/hiddena.htm

(if you want, of course, ahaha).

Last edited by Cyclops; 07/04/2010 at 10:35 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 07/04/2010, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Cyclops
I could have sworn you were NeFi, [your first post reminded me of pandapanda, an old poster here who is ENFp, who may want to check her out if you are bored or interested or something], your style of reasoning did seem atypical of INTp's esp in your first post, and by that I mean reasoning of NiTe ego.
Apologies for typos here.

Corrected.
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  #10  
Old 08/04/2010, 05:46 AM
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Cyclops:

Quote:
So[...], an ENFp who's somewhat reserved, likes to think of themself as logical, they score I and T, they are still N, viola, INTP test result! It's easy!
That's plausible, but it's unlikely that every one of an ENFp's girlfriends will at some point storm out on him shouting something like, "Have fun jerking off on all your machines, you ____ing cyborg!"

Interestingly enough, here's my recent result from Mizami's socionics test:

Your result
INTp ILI

These types might also be considered
ISTp SLI : ENTp ILE : ESTp SLE

These types are not very likely
INTj LII : ISTj LSI : ENTj LIE : INFp IEI

These types are quite unlikely
ESTj LSE : ISFp SEI : ENFp IEE : ESFp SEE

these types are extremely unlikely
INFj EII : ISFj ESI : ENFj EIE : ESFj ESE

So, Tp to the core. Mizami's test seems to take account of the cognitive multi-modality I mentioned earlier, where one's non-preferential functions predominate when conditions allow or necessitate. Examining types one letter removed from my own has also proven instructional as I often find aspects of myself there.

Quote:
It's not so much your lack of interest in star trek, it's more your understanding of the human side of people, you're ability to push things (engaging in good old fashioned lip lock) - could even indicate E, being able to laugh at yourself in the manner you did (INTx's are autistic), and your pleasantness in wishing them both good luck! (INTp's often apply caution).
It's possible by correlation that INTs are more frequently autistic than other types. However, psychological difficulty with empathy/emotion is different from biological inability. Both MBTI and socionics state that one's auxilliary function/id block usually strengthens with experience and maturity. For the rest of your comment, again, the watchword is modality.

Quote:
Oh, these points each on their own aren't great, the way I look at these things is to take them in their overall - the whole picture it presents rather than just isolated snap-shots, which is also what I thought about what you wrote.
My method is to conceptually atomize a situation into its constituent parts so they can be analyzed independently before re-integrating them into a cohesive whole to then be compared against the original real deal for verification and error correction.

Quote:
Perhaps you are female so that helps you be more in touch with your emotions.
Negatory, just some dude who's been around the block a few times, spends more time pondering humans than computers, and is trying to grow up a little bit. Hanging out with women doesn't hurt either. Most are rather interesting people, especially since, ever so thankfully, they aren't guys.

****************************************

Abeille, if you're still around, this thread seems to have originally been about you before I INTpishly made it all about me me me ME.

I think your prospects are good and you and your friend are lucky to connect on this level. If he's actually managed to verbalize affection for you without having a seizure he's in better shape than most INTps I know.

Check this link to see whether he's more the Philosopher or Expert subtype to give you a better idea of how to proceed, and then proceed.

http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...e=ILI_subtypes

Cheers.

Last edited by k0rps3y; 08/04/2010 at 05:48 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 08/04/2010, 09:21 AM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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@k-porps....

OK.

I'll point out again, that it doesn't matter how many times or on how many tests someone scores Tp, test results are only as good as the information put into them.

Quote:
However, psychological difficulty with empathy/emotion is different from biological inability. Both MBTI and socionics state that one's auxilliary function/id block usually strengthens with experience and maturity. For the rest of your comment, again, the watchword is modality.
What do you mean by the first sentence, can you give me an example?

Quote:
My method is to conceptually atomize a situation into its constituent parts so they can be analyzed independently before re-integrating them into a cohesive whole to then be compared against the original real deal for verification and error correction.
Can you give me an example of this? I don't understand.

Quote:
Negatory, just some dude who's been around the block a few times, spends more time pondering humans than computers, and is trying to grow up a little bit. Hanging out with women doesn't hurt either. Most are rather interesting people, especially since, ever so thankfully, they aren't guys.
Cool. Maybe you are just a normal person then Thank you for entertaining me.

Quote:
Abeille, if you're still around, this thread seems to have originally been about you before I INTpishly made it all about me me me ME.
How extraverted, lol.

OK K-korps, i'm not convinced you are INTp, ..(which doesn't mean I think you are definately ENFp, for sake of clarification) but then, it doesn't matter what I think, if it works for you then cool.

I won't question your type here again though.
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Old 08/04/2010, 12:32 PM
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I'll point out again, that it doesn't matter how many times or on how many tests someone scores Tp, test results are only as good as the information put into them.
Right, but if the shoe fits, and both MBTI and socionics stipulate that the test-taker is the only one qualified to make that determination, then... If you want to know what was asked, the tests I recall taking are the three here, the Jung typology test (M-B?) at humanmetrics.com, and the one at personalitypages.com, plus Mizami's socionics test at http://www.mizami.nl/public_html/questionnaire

Quote:
Quote:
However, psychological difficulty with empathy/emotion is different from biological inability.
What do you mean by the first sentence, can you give me an example?
Owing to mutated brains, autistics are physiologically incapable of understanding the thoughts or experiences of others. In early development, infants make no distinction between themselves, their parents, or the perceptible world at large. Neurologically normal babies eventually begin to differentiate themselves from other people and things, forming personalities along the way. Autistics, however, never learn or develop this differentiation and so they exhibit characteristic emotional, cognitive, and communication problems. INTs, on the other hand, have physically normal brains, but due to the confluence of their hereditary traits and life experiences they're inclined to discount, ignore, or even rail against emotional considerations. This is done partly to serve the interests of discovering and reporting objective truths, and also as a means of psychologically insulating themselves from the often disappointing and baffling world. So, INTs are frequently under-socialized but are capable of adjusting their thinking and behavior given sufficient opportunity and motivation. Autistics quite simply are not.

Quote:
Quote:
My method is to conceptually atomize a situation into its constituent parts so they can be analyzed independently before re-integrating them into a cohesive whole to then be compared against the original real deal for verification and error correction.
Can you give me an example of this? I don't understand.
If you ask me to make sense of your car 1) I'll pull it apart, 2) inspect the separate components to grasp their individual names and functions, 3) reassemble the parts into a whole car, 4) fire it up and drive it around to make sure it works correctly, 5) troubleshoot malfunctions as necessary, and finally 6) vomit my knowledge of your machine's workings all over you, inadvertently insulting your perceptivity, your intelligence, or your mother's perceptivity and intelligence along the way. Of course this assumes I don't get frustrated or bored in the process and find something more fun to do, like turning aside at step 3 to assemble a few interesting parts into a decidedly non-vehicular device or objet d'art.

If you like fiction, give Dostoevsky's "Notes from Underground" a read to understand this conceptual "atomization" and its possible psycho-social results.

Quote:
Quote:
Abeille, if you're still around, this thread seems to have originally been about you before I INTpishly made it all about me me me ME.
How extraverted, lol.
Beware behaviorism lest you're accused of being a closet Myers-Briggser. If I were an extrovert I'd be telling Abeille to dump what's-his-face, give me her number, and warn the hubby to clear out before I roll up in my Escalade. I'm just belatedly taking stock of the thread's origin while once again demonstrating that self-regard usually precedes tact with me me me me me were you aware that I live in my head me. Incidentally, much of what drew me to the INFp I know is her kindliness and consideration for others, which I find admirable and worthy of emulation.

Abeille, pin that dude to the ground and make him squeal before he talks himself out you. It's the surest way.
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Old 08/04/2010, 01:01 PM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Right, but if the shoe fits, and both MBTI and socionics stipulate that the test-taker is the only one qualified to make that determination, then...
afaik MBTI does this due to some sort of ethical consideration, socionics has no rules that i'm aware of.
Quote:
If you want to know what was asked, the tests I recall taking are the three here, the Jung typology test (M-B?) at humanmetrics.com, and the one at personalitypages.com, plus Mizami's socionics test at http://www.mizami.nl/public_html/questionnaire
I'm aware of all the tests.

Look at it this way, i've known many people, one example: they type a particular type, say ISTp for ages, they identify with it, then for some reason(s) or other they then start typing as INTj, INFj, INTp, and each time they supposedly identify completely with the type.

If you stick around you will see this phenomenon for yourself, many times over.

I'll not say this again.

Quote:
Owing to mutated brains, autistics are physiologically incapable of understanding the thoughts or experiences of others. In early development, infants make no distinction between themselves, their parents, or the perceptible world at large. Neurologically normal babies eventually begin to differentiate themselves from other people and things, forming personalities along the way. Autistics, however, never learn or develop this differentiation and so they exhibit characteristic emotional, cognitive, and communication problems. INTs, on the other hand, have physically normal brains, but due to the confluence of their hereditary traits and life experiences they're inclined to discount, ignore, or even rail against emotional considerations. This is done partly to serve the interests of discovering and reporting objective truths, and also as a means of psychologically insulating themselves from the often disappointing and baffling world. So, INTs are frequently under-socialized but are capable of adjusting their thinking and behavior given sufficient opportunity and motivation. Autistics quite simply are not.
Ah, so you mean a recognised disability over a socioinic type. Well, it's quite sensible to think that the brain is organised in a particular way which facilitates the type the person has, aspergers (for instance) can improve their understanding of people the same way as weak F people, but yes, type is not the same as serious brain damage, fortunately.


Quote:
If you ask me to make sense of your car 1) I'll pull it apart, 2) inspect the separate components to grasp their individual names and functions, 3) reassemble the parts into a whole car, 4) fire it up and drive it around to make sure it works correctly, 5) troubleshoot malfunctions as necessary, and finally 6) vomit my knowledge of your machine's workings all over you, inadvertently insulting your perceptivity, your intelligence, or your mother's perceptivity and intelligence along the way. Of course this assumes I don't get frustrated or bored in the process and find something more fun to do, like turning aside at step 3 to assemble a few interesting parts into a decidedly non-vehicular device or objet d'art.
I mean in the sense of type. My point is that analysing little parts of a type description can create problems rather than taking the type description in it's entirety. I was more interested in you giving an example from a socionics perspective (given that was what we were talking about....) Perhaps I should have clarified more, my bad.


Quote:
If you like fiction, give Dostoevsky's "Notes from Underground" a read to understand this conceptual "atomization" and its possible psycho-social results.
My point was to elude to that with type, the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts.



Quote:
Beware behaviorism lest you're accused of being a closet Myers-Briggser. If I were an extrovert I'd be telling Abeille to dump what's-his-face, give me her number, and warn the hubby to clear out before I roll up in my Escalade. I'm just belatedly taking stock of the thread's origin while once again demonstrating that self-regard usually precedes tact with me me me me me were you aware that I live in my head me. Incidentally, much of what drew me to the INFp I know is her kindliness and consideration for others, which I find admirable and worthy of emulation.
hehe, you tell me to watch being a closet MB (as if the accusation would bother me), then proceed to ... lead by example?

My post was tongue in cheek, well half and half.

Here's the explanation for you:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Admin
Self-preoccupation and unconscious deficit in self-esteem are not necessarily connected with any particular type. However, the extraverts in general have more potential for narcissism than the introverts. People are the objects and the ideas they discuss are the subjects. The extraverted standpoint is the one that sets the object above the subject, hence for the extravert it's all "Me, Me, Me". The introverted standpoint is the one that sets the subject above the object, so for the introvert an idea gets priority. This is more or less how Jung tried to explain E/I difference in his "Psychological Types". The most obvious form of narcissism is probably preoccupation with own appearance. In this case the Extravert-Sensing type (ESXx) could be the one called "the most narcissistic type" with ESFp and ESTp at the top of the list.
From

http://www.socionics.com/advan/qa.htm?1103061923

If you have studied Jungs psychological types, and studied what it really means to be an extravert, you would realise that Me Me Me is not particularly the behaviour of an introvert.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abeille
But, I am often the one making the first steps, contacting him first and getting him to come meet me. He has invited me out a few times, but 75% of the time, it's me making the first moves. When we meet, he's often the first one to leave. If we have a moment where things seem to be moving toward a romantic relation, he'll play hermit for a few days after that. But he always comes back and always seems even more into me than before. There seems to be some sort of battle going on inside of him.

I can't quite read him. Is this normal INTP behavior? Is he only acting this way because I am not yet divorced? He is a very sensitive guy and not at all a "player". Should I wait for him to make a move? Or do I make a move? If I make a move, how do I let him know how I feel? I don't want to ruin this friendship.
Well, I could say that it's related to his Fi HA, but it's maybe also worth pointing out that his personality will come into play along with his type, but not uncommon behaviour in Fi HA types, definately.

Last edited by Cyclops; 08/04/2010 at 01:09 PM.
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  #14  
Old 08/04/2010, 04:52 PM
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stanprollyright stanprollyright is offline
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It seems like Abeille left...but in case she comes back, you might want to start a new thread to continue this discussion.

But while I'm here:
k0rps3y seems very ILI to me.

I severely doubt autism is related to type; the way I see it autistic people have certain characteristics that people generally associate with INTx's, just usually in a more extreme form.

I warn you, k0rps3y, not to combine MBTI, Kiersey, and socionics. They are different systems with different functions and different goals. Kiersey is an offshoot of MBTI, and they are both concerned with personality traits and career niches. Socionics attempts to map cognitive processes and analyze interpersonal relationships. Despite what people [removed] believe, you aren't always the same type in all three systems.
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So this one time me an' my bes' frien' Stan, we went to a church service. That preacher was talkin' 'bout hell. So Stan leans over to me an' he says, "I bet hell is like a PoLR hit every day."

An' I says, "Stan, you prolly right."

Last edited by Banter; 08/04/2010 at 08:02 PM.
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  #15  
Old 08/04/2010, 04:59 PM
Cyclops Cyclops is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stanprollyright View Post
It seems like Abeille left...but in case she comes back, you might want to start a new thread to continue this discussion.

But while I'm here:
k0rps3y seems very ILI to me.

I severely doubt autism is related to type; the way I see it autistic people have certain characteristics that people generally associate with INTx's, just usually in a more extreme form.

I warn you, k0rps3y, not to combine MBTI, Kiersey, and socionics. They are different systems with different functions and different goals. Kiersey is an offshoot of MBTI, and they are both concerned with personality traits and career niches. Socionics attempts to map cognitive processes and analyze interpersonal relationships. Despite what people [removed] believe, you aren't always the same type in all three systems.
What's with all the attacking?

Prom afaik - has the view that a person is the same type on all the 3 systems because the dichotomies are the same on all the systems. He has a point to an extent, they are at least described (when you look at dichotomy description) fairly similar.

Apparently autistic people are more likely to test at NT types - however, that doesn't mean they are NT types, it simply means that's what they test as. I've known some aspergers people. I have even known an Fe type aspergers. Perhaps not necessarily fair to put on one example, but this guy was ... kinda dangerous, sort of like evil Brian (or at least what an evil Brian could be like) from family guy.

In regards to korpsies type, I said I wouldn't question it again, and I haven't, but I agree INTp seems more likely from the further details.

Oh, regards to starting another thread, why? Speak to a mod or mind your own business, it's kinda irritating having someone pop up with these suggestions, randomly attacking another user (Prom) then stating something as fact yourself...which is sort of what Prom does?

Anyway, I disagree with the implication that socionic type can't help with career choice. If you see my other thread you will see there is pattern, and I won't dispute what my eyes tell me. Please be more open minded.

Last edited by Banter; 08/04/2010 at 08:08 PM.
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  #16  
Old 08/04/2010, 08:26 PM
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stanprollyright stanprollyright is offline
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Starting a new thread to continue.
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So this one time me an' my bes' frien' Stan, we went to a church service. That preacher was talkin' 'bout hell. So Stan leans over to me an' he says, "I bet hell is like a PoLR hit every day."

An' I says, "Stan, you prolly right."
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  #17  
Old 10/04/2010, 01:06 PM
Nik Nik is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k0rps3y View Post
Abeille, pin that dude to the ground and make him squeal before he talks himself out you. It's the surest way.
I have to laugh at this. This worked for my husband.
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