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Old 22/09/2007, 01:44 PM
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Default ISFP?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32gsiqbjbk8
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Old 23/09/2007, 12:12 AM
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Oh god, it was so repetitive I could not finish watching it, but she is good.
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Old 23/09/2007, 12:51 PM
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Such answer shows how weak your Sensing function is. It is not repetitive, every time there is something changing. The last part is beautiful, just concentrate and be "in" the music, think of nothing else.

It has been 23 years that you know your type, have you started working on your weak functions or not yet?
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Old 01/10/2007, 02:11 AM
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What does that have to do with his weak functions? Maybe he is just not into classical. Personally I love music but couldn't stand that song because it was boring.
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Old 01/10/2007, 11:40 AM
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I haven't got a weak function left, muahahaha!
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Old 29/12/2007, 04:58 PM
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If you think that piece is repetitve, SG, you're obviously not listening properly. You only think it's boring because it doesn't assault your senses to the point where you don't have to really listen to get the message. With an exquisite piece like this, you have to actually concentrate and put a bit of effort into listening in order to appreciate it.
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Old 29/12/2007, 05:31 PM
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Right, Serge doesn't know how to listen.
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Old 29/12/2007, 08:17 PM
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Right, Serge doesn't know how to listen.
I agree, tho no ones perfect, eh Serge ?
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Old 30/12/2007, 11:36 AM
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If you think that piece is repetitve, SG, you're obviously not listening properly. You only think it's boring because it doesn't assault your senses to the point where you don't have to really listen to get the message. With an exquisite piece like this, you have to actually concentrate and put a bit of effort into listening in order to appreciate it.
I don't know about you, but I can see the next bit coming in that piece which makes it boring and repetitive for me.

It is like a teacher saying "Children today we will learn how to spell HAPPY! Let's repeat after me, H...A...P... (At this point it becomes obvious and boring unless the teacher cocks up, then it might be exciting) ..P...Y! (No, no cock up...boring.)
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Old 30/12/2007, 01:17 PM
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I don't know about you, but I can see the next bit coming in that piece which makes it boring and repetitive for me.
I think the whole point of sensing it is to live in the moment and not to predict what is coming next. You may think you can predict what is coming next but perhaps only peripherally, because to sense it correctly you will notice the slight variations and feelings the performer is putting into it. Your form of prediction is more likely to work if it was constructed by a computer on some sort of midi system..and that is more likely to be boring. Although this 'house' music, and what have you, can re-create the same pleasurable sensation over and over (I would say it is similar to the pleasure received from the rythmic action of running) - it is simply being able to enjoy this pleasurable sensation.

Interestingly, do you feel this way about sex, because isn't that repetitive, and we all know whats coming next

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It is like a teacher saying "Children today we will learn how to spell HAPPY! Let's repeat after me, H...A...P... (At this point it becomes obvious and boring unless the teacher cocks up, then it might be exciting) ..P...Y! (No, no cock up...boring.)
This is also interesting, because one never really knows what is coming next when dealing with people. You may have sussed how to spell HAPPY, but if you switch off too early, you won't catch something else after that, which you didn't know, or maybe even find out you didn't know how to spell HAPPY at all. This is the art of listening, and keeping in mind that even if you do know, the teacher doesn't know that, and is only trying to do their job. IE if she didn't tell you how to spell HAPPY, and later on you didn't know, then she wouldn't have done her job properly, and you would have complained about that also.

Last edited by Cyclops; 30/12/2007 at 01:25 PM.
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Old 30/12/2007, 02:47 PM
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Ok SG, just stay with me a bit.

How does sensation evolve? through repitition. Your tendancy as an N is to try to look for something new, but if you really want to make your sensation function progress you have to be patient and do the repititions.

One usually never stops bragging about the things he knows how to do, until one discovers the necessity to develop other horizons or gets so bored (if you don't stop doing the things you know too well how to do, then sooner or later you will get bored). So then one says: why didn't I come to explore these new huge territories before? because they are very new, and this is the thing we just needed. So one has to be a bit patient while working over the tertiary and inferior functions, in the beginning it is annoying but after a while one starts feeling good for making ones first steps in the new territories like a baby who starts to walk, now of course the baby will fall down and these must not discourage it. With a lot of persistence the baby will learn to walk pretty well. But in the beginning he needs the support of his parents to make him stand over his feet. So if one has troubles activating a weak function, the help of someone else will do it.

After having done some progress one starts running the risk of inflation.
What is inflation? It's simply ego's pride of progressing which one has to be careful of. This invites one to stop his work thinking that he is done developping his potentials. Remember that ego wants results, you however need to forget about accomplishing while working: you need to be "in" the work, in the moment...



By the way let me add something: why am I the only one who aims at personal integration, why isn't there anybody on this forum who would like to give it a shit?
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Last edited by complicater-complexer; 30/12/2007 at 02:48 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 31/12/2007, 04:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SG View Post
I don't know about you, but I can see the next bit coming in that piece which makes it boring and repetitive for me.

It is like a teacher saying "Children today we will learn how to spell HAPPY! Let's repeat after me, H...A...P... (At this point it becomes obvious and boring unless the teacher cocks up, then it might be exciting) ..P...Y! (No, no cock up...boring.)
Hey SG, you may think you can anticipate what's going to happen but I bet if you listened to the first few bars of the piece you wouldn't be able to write out the rest of it. If you can, you should think about doing some composing of your own. But seriously, you only think it's predictable in hindsight because it makes such perfect sense musically. And I agree with Cyclops - you mustn't be taking in the nuances and feeling - only the bare notes which are nothing without the emotion.
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Old 31/12/2007, 01:50 PM
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I know a bit about music and you can predict the rest of the song by the first few bars, if it is the cheap pop song. But when it is a complicated classical piece then it won't be possible obviously. As it stands, the piece in question follows logical pattern of development a -> b -> c -> a^2 -> b^2 -> c^2 -> a^3 ->... can you guess the rest? I'm really good with 'figure what is next in a sequence' on IQ tests.
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Old 31/12/2007, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
I know a bit about music and you can predict the rest of the song by the first few bars, if it is the cheap pop song. But when it is a complicated classical piece then it won't be possible obviously. As it stands, the piece in question follows logical pattern of development a -> b -> c -> a^2 -> b^2 -> c^2 -> a^3 ->... can you guess the rest? I'm really good with 'figure what is next in a sequence' on IQ tests.
You missunderstand, sensation is not over when you know what is coming next. You haven't done sensation at all when you know the next sensory stimuli, sensation is about experiencing the stimuli in the present regardless whether you knew beforehand or not about it.

As I can see, while listenning to the music you are not listenning, you are analyzing by perceiving the evolution of the structure of the music. This is not how one listens to music, you can do it while evaluating the genious of the composer but not while tasting the music.

I am wondering why do you eat a plate and not a mixture of plates? There is repitition while eating the same plate. Right? It is the same taste that is being repeated with each spoon in mouth.
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Last edited by complicater-complexer; 31/12/2007 at 03:16 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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Old 31/12/2007, 06:15 PM
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I can't see why do you think that it is not possible to appreciate the music emotionally while noting it's logical structure at the same time?
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Old 31/12/2007, 06:49 PM
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Quote:
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I can't see why do you think that it is not possible to appreciate the music emotionally while noting it's logical structure at the same time?
I've know a little about music also, and i've got quite a good ear for it, and sometimes if I'm listening to a song I will decipher what instruments are being played, what key it is in and the chords that the song is using, but this doesn't detract from my enjoyment of the moment of it, and the sensations it creates within me.

I think the difference is that you are creating the impression that once you've figured it out, you lose interest IE its boring and the only way to regain your interest is by a mistake occuring. Sensing isn't looking for the mistake, sensing enjoys the repetitiveness of the pleasurable sensation..and the little variances that occur within that.

Maybe this analogy will help you.. If repitition was no good, then a lot of pop songs, including lots of the beatles, would be well past their expiry date as most of it is repeat repeat repeat, repeat the same three chords - C F G
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Old 31/12/2007, 07:09 PM
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Question

Can you go to the left and go to the right at the same time?

Look what believe: one should listen the first time and than analyze. If you perceive the logical structure from the beginning then you would have banalized the music.

Here you have a beautiful passage written by Osho in his book Intuition:

Quote:
The more you know, the bigger the distance; the less you know, the lesser the distance. And if you are in a moment of not knowing, there is no distance; you are bridged.

You fall in love with a woman or a man - the day you fall in love there is no distance. There is only wond er, a thrill, an excitement, an ecstacy - but no knowledge. You don't know who this woman is. Without knowledge there is nothing to divide you; hence the beauty of those first moments of love. Once you have lived with the woman - only for twenty-four hours - knowledge has arisen. Now you have some ideas about the woman; you know who she is, there is an image. Twenty-four hours have created a past; those twenty-four hours have left marks on the mind. You look at the same woman, there is no longer the same mystery. You are coming down that hill, that peak is lost.
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  #18  
Old 31/12/2007, 07:49 PM
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Can you go to the left and go to the right at the same time?

Look what believe: one should listen the first time and than analyze. If you perceive the logical structure from the beginning then you would have banalized the music.

Here you have a beautiful passage written by Osho in his book Intuition:
I'm not quite sure I know what your getting at, and I don't want to get off topic.

But this quote, how can it be love if you don't know someone, does this not therefore highlight lust ?
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Old 31/12/2007, 08:16 PM
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Can you go to the left and go to the right at the same time?
Can you hear and see at the same time whilst driving a car and eating a sandwich? Don't think it is possible.
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Old 31/12/2007, 08:42 PM
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Can you hear and see at the same time whilst driving a car and eating a sandwich? Don't think it is possible.
I'm taking this literally and saying yes, I can, although the sandwich used to be a cigarette before I quit.

I can do all that and think about what I'm hearing and seeing and contemplating the sensation that and the sandwich is creating in me (ie taste chewing etc), as well as sporadically thinking about other general stuff.

I take it for granted but maybe this is an example of using a strong sensing function. Kinda makes me wonder how powerful other dominant functions must be.
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