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| Question #1242640481 | Monday, 18-May-2009 |
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| Are two people doomed to never get along if their types conflict, even if they care for one another and want to work through their differences and accept one another? Is total acceptance of someone so different, who sees the world so differently, really feasible in terms of a meaningful friendship. I ask because I'm ENFP and one of my closest friends is INTP, and although I love him to pieces, he sometimes drives me crazy with his tactlessness and analytical judgements that lack emotional sensitivity, despite my admiration for his intellect and his sense of humour. In turn, I often aggravate him with my over-emotional outbursts, which usually occur as a result of something he has said, which he feels I take too personally. When we get along, we share so much and we have lots of fun together, and we are always there for one another when times are hard, but at the same time I feel we have too many bust-ups and it's sapping my energy to deal with things in a healthy, rational way. Does anyone relate to this? -- Dave |
Your Answers: 1+ |
| A1 I don't think it's doomed. If anything maybe the both of you can use socionics to have a better understanding of each other. Relations of conflicts however are doomed. I ran across socionics after a relationship with a conflict partner that i very much cared about failed in spite of all our attempts to make it work, and it described exactly what I experienced. I was so amazed. What you're describing reflects very much the description of the Illusionary relationship. It's not doomed but you both need to accept the other as they are and know that you won't transform the INTP into a feeler. -- Anonymous |
| A2 ENFp's and INTp's are not conflicting types, they're Illusionary, which can be energy draining/tiring after a while but certainly not up there with Conflicting or Super-Ego relations. From experience, though, I do believe that bad intertype relationships are doomed to fail. My parents, for instance, are conflictors and although they're still married they have never and will never be able to have a compatible relationship. It has nothing to do with them being bad people but having functions that annoy and stifle the other other. My dad also has a greater advantage in the relationship since he is an aggressor and my mother is an infantile, which leaves him with the power to, basically, scare her into doing whatever he wants. I have a Super-Ego relationship with my father and a mirror one with my mother which completely explains why I can easily connect with her, but with my father, I find that I can't spend more than a few minutes with him without feeling weighed down. In general, I believe the people who claim that intertype relationships do not forecast how a relationship will turn out have not has enough experience with both bad and good ones to know what kind of impact it can have. Being around a conflicting type for a short time is not comparable to being close to them for years; I can be friendly to such a person but anything beyond acquaintances is a bad idea, it's not healthy -- An INFj |
| A3 I'll second that, doom to pieces. As an ENTp I have, say, considerable challenge dealing with ISFJ's. The ones I met. They are the most easy to discover of all the types for me, like picking them out in a crowd through 500 yards in a rainstorm, to use some graphical expression of the phenomena. Intitially they are quite accomodating, orderly and polite, I give them that, and I endeavour to behave likewise, but then something sneaks in, and things starts to get ugly after a while. or should I say, challenging with considerable resistance, they usually start tweaking, interpreting and adding to absurdness things I say, and I respond with surprised>disbeliefed>overbearing>condescent attitude, in that order as the process carries on, until reaching a point where they become deauthorized completely. With that, I mean that whatever they say afterwards seize to bear any significance and impact, unless it is something smart. From that on, I dont care about them anylonger. They can say whatever they want, and I do not mind. Which they of course sense, and the inward spiral of deconstructive interactions tightens up to consolidated entrenched entanglement. As a challenge though, I may find it rewarding to act with them nevertheless, beeing polite and accomodating, but that is done with an agenda to see how I can perform in such strain environment, and the efforts soon takes its toll, I can tell. That is hardly a sound platform to build relationships on. But that is OK too, when the fundamentals are as described. What's the use to press on further? -- Anonymous |
| A4 Just because two people aren't compatible socionic types doesn't mean they're doomed to hate each other or not be friends. If you want to marry someone or be really committed to someone in whatever way (business partner, spouse, room mate) it may be wise to consider that you may not see eye to eye if you're a conflicting pair. But as far as friends and whoever else is in your life, it doesn't really matter. -- Anonymous |
| A5 A3, I agree, you have to try to maintain a polite atmosphere with conflicting types, especially if you're required to be around them, such as a family member or co-worker. It also gives you a better idea as to how to interact with, like you mentioned, as to prevent any conflicts. Those of us who are aware of Socionics also need to know when it's time to leave a period of interaction as well as to prevent the other person from harming our ego, and vice-versa. Like I mentioned about my Super-Ego father (ISTj), I've learned to just avoid or shorten interaction with him since we both say and do things that are, unintentionally, harming the other -- An INFj |
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| A6 to A5 from A3. Yes, you enhanced and broadened what I said in a superior way, and brought a feeling perspective into it. And that is good. Since from my standpoint it may have seemed that I endeavoured continued interaction by the sole purpose of strenghtening my own character. Which is allright if done with good integrity, and not as an ego trip, as it may have appeared, easy trap to fall into by the way. But it is not optimal yet. You brought in the value of each involved, and that is a higher representation of the consequences, and is the ultimate outcome. Since you are an INFJ, it didnt surprised me to see that you managed to add those things, I know a couple of people with the same type, and I have high regards for this type's ability to see and discover the substructures and fundamentals in various situations and experiences. I have learned much from them. They are easy and comfortable to talk with. To A4 , I may have triggered too fast with the "doom to pieces" thing. But it sure is a considerable challenge, although priceless if sucseeding. I am working on it. After all, first one need to acknowledge it is possible, then one need to dedicate efforts in it, and then eventually improvement may come by, step by step, effort by effort. And it may be a contagious and selfperpetuating nature in it, who knows? Now, I will add something to why an ENTp-ISFJ interaction may have those consequences I conveyed, I thought a little about the cause-effect chain afterwards, as to what initiates the ISFJ's picking and tweaking as I experience. If any ENTp read this, look to see if it have any experiential resemblences; OK, here goes: When I first meet them they are as described, polite, orderly and accomodating, and I can tell, each and one of them endeavoured to do so. I can see that in a person. They meant it. But, here is the great BUT, I am quite direct with people, shoot from the hip, in everything I say, like if I consider my self as an a**hole in a situation, I can flat out say that to other people. In my world that is just a description of an action, not an association to my personality. I did a thing in an undesirable way, that's all. Which can be learned from and reworked for later occations. A state of fact. But I cant learn from anything I wont acknowledge. That was one example, and I have driven people on the defensive with it. And that is something that surprises me, because that was'nt intentional. Now, with ISFJ's I have experienced quite fast their inability to handle such form of communication, and when I see that, I need to restrain myself without knowing why I have to. That just got to have some impact in the attitude I display towards them, and of course they start to wonder what kind of reasons there are behind this change. And start their own change in attitude accordingly, and from now on, there is a battle of some kind going on, with subjective rationalisation as a model of explanation. OK, maybe, since I am confrontational in nature, maybe I should try sometime to set the table, and in objective terms line out the whole thing, and see what happens. I have tried that in a very small extent, but there is this barrier; They appear extremely easy to throw off the balance, and if that perception is accurate, there will be challenges even then. -- Anonymous |
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