| Socionics Personals |  | Female
Straight
16-25
Oceania
Libra
ENFj |
|  | Male
Straight
16-25
Middle East
Sagittarius
INTj |
|  | Male
Straight
26-35
North America
Pisces
INXj |
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| Questions & Answers |
| Question #1211213585 | Monday, 19-May-2008 |
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| I'd really like to know everyone's thoughts about Barack Obama's and John McCain's types. I feel like this is a pretty important question considering the magnitude of the coming elections in America. Let me start off this discussion by saying that I believe that Obama is ENFP (although in some photos, he seems to resemble INTP from visual ID). And I see John McCain as ESTJ. Would appreciate your feedback. Thanks. -- Doug |
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| A49 We seriously need socionics.com to settle this debate by placing both Obamas, Biden, Sarah Palin, and John McCain into their respective types on the ´types and celebrities page´. A48, do you also disagree with socionics.com´s typing of Bush as ESTP? I feel pretty confident that once this is all sorted out, we´ll be looking at a new administration filled with Deltas. I really don´t think Obama has Fe, because he´s not nearly as able to rally emotions in people as Bill Clinton, who had primary Fe. I think that what Obama extroverts is pretty obviously Ne, with all of his talk of change and new possibilities. He just doesn´t have the same connection with folks on a feeling level, leading many to call him ´emotionally flat´, and unable to connect with the ´common folk´. -- Ayahuasca |
| A50 btw, I forgot to add: a disconnection with the "common folk" is actually a good indication of Fe>Fi, being out of touch with reality is Ni>Ne -- An INFj |
A51 A single site labeling someone under one category doesn't settle a debate, it just opens a new one, as I don't think celebrity debates can be absolutely conclusive. I think one of the reasons Obama's type is throwing people off is because they presume all Beta's are like such-and-such, and that isn't so. Beta's are probably the most diverse quarda which causes Beta's to fight even amongst their own. There's everything from extreme left wingers to extreme right wingers and every thing in between in Beta, match that with the desire to unite and group and that can cause a lot of conflict amongst opposite opinions. There's also the stereotype that Beta NF's are all loud and obnoxious like Oprah, but that isn't true, especially when considering subtypes. Obama is not the "bouncing off the wall" kind of Beta NF but he still uses dominant Ni and Fe with a clear ignoring of Te and Si. His beliefs are very idealistic and almost abstract (Ni), they're "this is how it could/should be" not "this is reality, this is what we have to work with". Delta is not about radical, abstract, ideas where everyone is directed into a single Utopian concept, that's Beta. Delta is about using resources efficiently to make life comfortable for the individual, there's no single ideal involved, no great desire for change. If you feel a stronger connection with the more passionate, idealistic, Beta ideals than perhaps you have mistyped yourself? -- An INFj
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Obama is most probably ENFj, so now you have your own US Tony Blair  He will go on Types&Celebs page soon. |
| A52 For the record, I disagree strongly that Obama is most probably ENFJ. I know a number of ENFJ's and all of them without exception are quite histrionic and awkward in their physical movements. Not only is Obama often called 'no drama obama', but he is an excellent basketball player. So it seems to me that his lack of flair for drama and lack of physical awkwardness disqualifies him from being ENFJ. -- Anonymous |
| A53 Perhaps he is an INFp? -- An INFj |
| A54 So where's this update declaring Obama is an ENFJ? My guess is the folks at Socionics realized that there are far too many Deltas in the new administration to consider Barack a Beta. I'll be very interested to hear the final verdict on this. -- Anonymous |
| A55 What Deltas are in the new administration? What precisely is Delta about them? -- An INFj |
| A56 wow A 48 got it totally wrong -- Anonymous |
| A57 Obama is ENFJ, Sarah palin is ESTP, like Bush and Mc Cain and last Clinton is not ESFJ, he reported himself as an ENFP- sophie -- Anonymous |
| A58 Why don't you answer my question about, "What Deltas are in the new administration? What precisely is Delta about them?", "Anonymous"? -- An INFj |
| A59 I've already explained that on other pages under my normal name: "Ayahuasca". I just forgot to type it this time. I think it's your turn to explain what is beta about this new administration anyways A58. -- Ayahuasca |
| A60 But you didn't explain it, you just stated what you think there types are without backing it up, "so and so is __" and what not, aside from Obama's wife, who you claimed is a dominant Te, stating Te is "intimidating to many folks", which is a poor understanding of the functions, as it's Se that signifies force and aggression, not Te. Obama is a physically enthusiastic, emotional, being, who is clearly skilled in Fe as he's a talented orator. He doesn't seem to value Te at all as his views show a favoring of idealistic visions with a disregard for an efficient or practical approach, Ni>Te. He foccuses on "uniting" people into a singular ideal, emphasizing words like "Us", "We" and "Change", his speeches also emphasize the majority(group) over the individual Beta>Delta. Beta's unite people, Delta's splinter off from groups, the former is Obama's platform. This is very different than the Delta approach, which is free of heavily passionate, emotional, oration. For this reason I can understand why Fe quadra types view Delta's as rather boring. -- An INFj |
| A61 To A60 INFj, the "explanations" you give for your assertions are far from tightknit, as there are *multiple* ways to typologically interpret the smidgen of points you have "provided." And yes, I agree with the other poster that Te IS intimidating to many folks, in its own right - not as outright aggression in the form of Se. -- Anonymous |
| A62 Hey, everyone who wants to squabble over Obama's type, here's the method of argumentation you should use. First, generate a list of adjectives that may - or may not - have anything to do with describing Obama. Doing research on this isn't important; you might as well just go with your "gut" or your impeccably perceptive intuitive impressions. Now, after you've assembled your list of Obama descriptors, begin linking them to the type of your choice. Be vague, use jargony explanations like 'Fe>Te' and 'Beta>>>Delta' to make your case. Pile on the overgeneralizations and superfluous stereotypes to solidify your argument. Add your own personal insight: "Obama prefers arugula over lettuce, which may be considered typical of Beta NFs." Try to speak with an air of authority. -- Anonymous |
| A63 What part of Obama's oration or personality is heavily passionate or emotional? I'm just not seeing it. If you're talking about the whole 'Yes We Can' slogan, that was an idea fed to Obama that he didn't even want to use in the first place. Seriously, you can look that up. Many have said that Obama often "doesn't have the ability to connect with the common folk and he is often emotionally flat in speeches". Have you heard this as well A60 or do I need to find articles documenting this? If Obama is an ENFJ like many think, then he should be lacking in physical coordination, and he shouldn't have the ability to be a good basketball player. While Obama has at least tried to unite people, which you seem to think is exclusively a Beta trait, I could make the argument that Obama's candidacy came originally from a splinter group-he certainly wasn't a Washington insider like Clinton and McCain. To me, Obama's got either primary or secondary Ne which gives rise to all the talk of change and new possibilities. -- Ayahusca |
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| A64 Hello, I am an ENFP, a particularly sensitive one most of my life, but tough as well. I justifiably understand and praise THINKING, the thing about it is. When you have alot of THINKERS who extrovert their THINKING and you don't know them, at all. For instance if I am at a party or get together and I approach a group of four or five people talking and proceed to talk to them for whatever reason/s, introduce myself, ask where the restrooms are whatever; and the someone in the group responds in a seemingly harsh possibly not meant to uh, extroverted thinking mode, it comes across to people like; well, lets just say, that ain't always great for business (first impressions) I don't know if you can relate, cliques, or another example, some hard driving thinking men and women, although great in their fields, would be horribly suited to say some service industries, they'd get fired for their extroverted thinking style. -- ENFP |
| A65 A62, nothing I posted is "over generalizations and superfluous stereotypes", they're all qualities listed under the definitions of the functions and quadras. They're obviously qualities about types that share a common connection, this is, however, the nature of typology. I based my views of Obama's type on mannerisms and on how he presents his views, not on insignificant trivial facts. If you have a problem with fitting people into boxes, so to speak, than perhaps socioncs is not for you -- An INFj |
| A66 Obama can easily invoke emotions both physically and vocally, that is what I meant by passionate and emotional. His inability to connect with "common folk" isn't a trait of dominant Fi, as Fi is about forming connections/relationships, whereas Fe is about understanding and using emotions to build a sense of unity, which is exactly what Obama is good at. I strongly disagree that being an ENFj or INFp would prevent someone from being good at athletics. If anything, IN*j and EN*p would be more prone to having poor physical coordination due to weak Se. The message of "change and possibility" in Obama's campaign is actually consistent with Beta values. Beta's like the idea of a common atmosphere where everyone is united for a single cause, changing power structures and defining hierarchies. Beta's are not these evil monsters out to destroy you, they're not all Hitlers and Stalins. They're many good Beta's who have done wonderful and self-sacrificing things for humanity. None the less, they all value the same functions and go about a similar way of implementing their values -- An INFj |
| A67 In response to A65: "They're all qualities listed under the definitions of the functions and quadras." Really? Because it sounds like most of it is bloated, intumesced, turgid drivel. Odd, that. Speaking of which, get over your invocations of the "liberal elitist" stereotype as well. Inability to connect with the common folk? Um. Right. Also, you seem to have a very limited grasp of the American political landscape, which isn't really helping you in your quest to say anything remotely intelligent about Obama, is it? -- Anonymous |
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