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| Question #1210345584 | Friday, 9-May-2008 |
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I'm confused as to how the hidden agenda of INTp's is to love, based on observed behavior and the little I know of Type... So if an INTP could explain it to me that would be great =D. Firstly, wouldn't a Type that wants to love be a little less... antisocial? I don't mean introverted, I mean hostile to interaction. In general a lot of the hostility I see in INTp's would seem to contradict their desire to love, but maybe my definition of love is different from the intended one? Additionally, if  is the INTp's dominant trait (Maybe I'm confusing MBTI into this) then wouldn't a Feeling agenda like "To love" be inimical to them? I feel as if I'm missing something here. -- A. |
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| A1 As an INTp, this conflict of interest hits me often. It is almost existential. In a nutshell, I tend to hibernate and have very little interaction with others. I view "love" as being with that one person that you can be yourself around and who gets you for who you are without fear of ridicule and/or reprisal. As an INTp, I am very hard to get to know, seeming very cold and analytical upon first meeting. I am also one of the last to speak in a group discussion. In reality what I am doing is sizing everything up and gathering information while simultaneously collecting my own thoughts for a cohesive response. This might be what you are confused about. -- NHowell |
| A2 I don't think INTps are hostile to interaction. I look forward to interactions and I am happy when someone expresses desire to be friends with me. But if I am convinced that the person is too different from me or that he/she will be critical of me once he/she discovers my flaws, I will simply "clam up" and shy away from them. Even if I admire or want to be friends with someone, I act coldly or keep a certain distance, because I am afraid that he/she will not like me. But if the person manages to get me to open up and afterwards makes constant efforts to get close to me, I will welcome the interaction and generally care a lot about that person, even after we stop talking to one another or lose contact. If a good friend of mine tells me that he likes me (in a romantic way), I won't swoon over him just because of that, but I will want to like him, and if I do, I'd probably feel insanely happy. It's not that I don't like people, it's that I don't think people like ME. Most of the time, when I'm alone, I think pretty highly of myself... but when I'm with strangers, FORGET IT. I get paranoid as to whether I'm acting like a dork or not and remember the stupid things I'd said for weeks afterwards. If I make a fool of myself I feel extremely ashamed... and when people I don't really know make fun of or laugh at me (in a mean way, not as a joke) I feel sad and pathetic (note the "people I don't really know"- if I knew them well I'd probably direct all the ill will at THEM). I find things to admire in almost anyone, and I respect them for it, but I won't ever tell them that... because well, I don't feel like it! -- The INTp (in hiding) |
| A3 I once heard that hidden agendas are less 'what you secretly want above everything else' like people seem to think, and more 'something they want as much as a normal person, but struggle in achieving'. I don't know if this is definitely true, but it's an interesting and plausible angle. My boyfriend is an INTp that I successfully got into socionics, and he says he seems to think that that's possible (and that A1 is correct as well). -- Lena, ISFp |
| A4 A3: It could make sense, but then it should apply to all the other hidden agendas as well, no? -- Anonymous |
A5 i have the ultimate answer for u. why is it that i sense these INTPs are being ####y-assed again?! your question is 2-fold...how do INTPs come to there PoLR/hidden agenda...and your question assertion of how this works in tandem with your observations of INTPs as being hostile to interaction which clearly as u said - contrasts very ILLOGI-CAbiliy with there PoLR. First the hidden agenda (this is only the factual stuff necassary to get to the real meaty centre-cause it's simplicity is so simple it will blow your mind as being very logical): as INTPs having the socionic metabolism of   (not a primary as u said)..we are very much in the mode of defining everything...u would notice that neither or is people centred. as such, working in these confinds, and being human...just like any other...INTPs begin to sense very acutely there need for human interaction..they sense also, that only a subset of the population can benefit from them...there are thier earst-while WORKING interactions in ENTPs (  )etc,.who share there focusses (and revelations) but few of the INTP hang-ups (so even to entps, we are like poor cousins)...and then there are ESFPs who INTPs sense at a distance...cause this ESFP group seems to share the intp perceptual set-up. in opposition to A1...i admit to INTP social HOSTILITY..i have it to/less now/but then again i have more back-up and intelligibility in the task now, without losing anything as in the past..but admittedly this decays in some ways so-that INTPs can come to express the opinion A1 has...but for the majority of INTPs in new life situations where ESFPs begin to sense them and begin to wonder 'what the F##k is going on here'...we have to stick with your 'social hostility' definition. Its very simple..my meaty centre..welcome to a new perceptual concept..i call it 'dual defined personality'.. .,the dual of an INTP being ESFP with   , the definitions which go with /Se/Sensory External...are basically in one sense 'world power'...i.e. force and interaction applicability in the world. the working concept of an INTP is that they would bolster this...INTPs thus show a territorial sense....so while u ESFPs would like nothing better than to interact with an INTP, and wonder why this is not forthcoming, the INTPs primary intent is to show is the following: 'i can maintain territory' and i have nothing lacking in heritage....In general it is a communication scheme which speaks to the inard of an ESFP but has little tactical sense in setting up communication. so now u know the reason...i could not get it out any better...but it's the first time i had to design an answer to answer this sense of the question u had...practise makes perfect..i will maul with it. later -- @sirac |
| A6 Dear A5: ..was that supposed to make sense? -- Anonymous |
| A7 A., you might be interested in the article on vulnerable functions at socionist.blogspot.com. As to the INTp HA, I would like to add that it is not Fe but Fi, which does not mean so much communication or expressing affection, but a desire to have a deep relationship with a person or an abstract thing, based on inner motivation. Guessing by the INTps I know, it could be this Fi HA that makes them become pastors or literary scholars: they have a deep relationship with God or love certain kind of literature, but as they are NTs, the relationship is not very visible and they need to analyze it. And BTW, I have just met an INTp who regularly organizes trips to places of historical importance for people he knows. He is so very goofy, demanding and incommunicative during these trips, but still everyone enjoys them. I think it is partly because he is a good organizer and partly because people sense this Fi in him, somehow subconsciously knowing that he is doing that all for them. -- ESFp |
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| A8 A7, that's interesting. It seems it's true, if you are seeing good in an INTp, then there really is someone for everyone? -- Anonymous |
A9 Well, did I got it right that you are seeing good in yourself but are afraid no-one other will ever be able to see it? It would be interesting for me to know if this is true, as it seems my INTp friends have this kind of notion but I am not sure if I am not just imagining it. - Yes, of course, at least potentially, there is someone for everyone - see the Dual conception. And returning to your original question and this INTp guide guy, his hostility to interaction helped me immensely: I was working with him as the second guide and the last day I got so tired I wasnt able to do anything, and he ordered everyone not to speak to me, which was exactly what I needed at the moment, but I am so friendly and out-going I would never be able to order this myself. See, even hostility to interaction can be very useful sometimes  -- ESFp |
A10 ESFp that was very perceptive-you are right in pretty much what you say there, except I am not INTp I am ISTp, although this means that I have same Fe PoLR as INTp and therefore same social "issues." Your Fi is a powerful tool and I like. It's interesting what you say as i've found that my INFj friend thinks it's impressive how I can say such things and with conviction, were he wouldn't, but also interestingly i've found ENFp's not so receptive to it. You know i've always liked and got on with ESFp's - maybe I am an INTp after all haha  -- Anonymous |
| A11 There needs to be the right person to bring out the outgoing side of an INTp. Otherwise the INTp will close up, and seem distant all the time. And yes, an INTp would appreciate that constant effort to befriend them despite their apparent lack of sociability. Perhaps sometimes they just wrongly assume that the other person has a hidden agenda to befriend them, that's why they're so cautious in making friends. -- Anonymous |
| A12 The INTp usually believes that his impressions of the world are correct. However, he has to vet those views with others to put them into useable form so discussions are thoroughly enjoyed; external stimulus is necessary in order for the INTp to produce output. The INTp, deep down, seeks attention to and validation of his own set of values although he may deny that even to himself. He needs a continual sounding board or someone with whom to experiment but this person would need to be flexible and somewhat malleable to his views. I think that “to love” in the INTp sense would be a little more like “to mentor”. -- I/O |
| A13 I am an ISFP and have been involved in 2 romantic relationships with INTPs. I agree that INTPs want "to love". I feel loved by them through their actions, not their words. They express their love physically. Otherwise, they are distant in communication but I've learned not to take it personally. -- ISFP lover |
| A14 I'm an INTP and reading your first question got me thinking. INTP's as hostile...the only time I would consider myself hostile socially is when a person I don't like is talking to me or I can like someone but if they are talking nonsense or acting stupid I clam up and sometimes my answers are very short and sweet...sometimes borderline rude. I'm mainly trying to get them to stop talking to me. (This also could be because of my own mood and not anything to do with said person attempting to communicate) I'm curious as to what type you are? That would help determine why you might deem the INTP's behavior as hostile? -- Anonymous |
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