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Question #1194217660Sunday, 4-Nov-2007
Category: ENFj ISTp Intertype Relations
For all the ISTP out there, I want to know what makes you guys hate an ENFJ naturaly. -- ENFJ
Your Answers: 1+ 21+ 36+ 52+ 55+ 72+ 76+
A21 I really think it is the bossy impatient aspect of EJs that can really **** of IPs. On the positive you as an ENFJ are incredibly driven to make a positive (to the best of your efforts) change in other people, here is the kicker: Whether they like it or not. This, sometimes arrogant seeming attitude can upset the more laid back, emergency style ISTP. I have never seen an ISTP lose their cool, I mean I think there has to be a nuculear attack or perhaps a large asteroid coming at earth for them to start to really show it. ENFJ on the other hand is very gifted at emotional expression. You have an amazing ability to effortlessly translate emotions in to words, and this is not something that is easy to do for many people. Unfortunately this emotional style does not always consider how other people feel necessarily, but how the ENFJ THINKS they feel. Your best bet is to communicate this problem with your ISTP friend. Explain that you only had good intentions but that A) B) and C) upset you about them. If I know ISTPs enough, they might resist your words at first, but give them some time to assimilate your information and I think you will notice that they are amazingly adaptable people (just like you can be). Finally, always try and judge whether you are being reasonable? Is your passion leading you to be unfair towards an ISTP who would be silently noticing this? How often are you aware of unspoken discomfort from your ISTP counterpart? I know as an ENFJ you are very proactive, but try asking the ISTP what he wants for a change. Many people don't like someone else deciding what they like, give them an opportunity to decide and you can carry it out, this may not be as fun, but it is infinitely more helpful to many people. After all, who wants someone else to make decisions for them (don't answer that!). In summary, I think you can work best with the ISTP if you relax your normally focused areas. Just chill with the ISTP and go with the flow. Let them dictate how events are going to happen, don't preempt every action by taking the first step. Goodluck, communicate honest, and see if things don't improve, clearly if you are here you have the best of intentions and this ISTP is lucky to have a friend like you to hate. -- Anonymous
A22 they aren't respectful unless you make them be respectful. unless you pay attention to the dominance "rank" game, and make sure you outrank them, they will be disrespectful to you and say bad things about you when you aren't around. -- Anonymous
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A23 Base on personal experience, enfjs are the ones that hate and dislike istps naturally. They tend to be socially status conscious, judgemental, can be socially manipulative by bringing their friends or others against you and look down on istps for no apparent reason. They sometimes act friendly towards you but only to laugh at your back or gossip when your not around. They tend to be bolder in doing this when they are with friends. Worst of all, they can fool authority figures in believing they are good natured. This behavior is not only childish but utterly detestable and illogical. It seems like an act of desperation for acceptance and love from other people. -- istp
A24 Looks like we'll never get on then eh? -- Anonymous
A25 "they aren't respectful unless you make them be respectful. unless you pay attention to the dominance "rank" game, and make sure you outrank them, they will be disrespectful to you and say bad things about you when you aren't around. - Anonymous" I think this is ridiculous. If you want to live your life by attempting to play a "dominance game" with people, you can do as you wish, but I think most people would agree that this is immature behavior. A23, I know what you mean, and have seen this behavior, and I think your last sentence is truly correct. I think all NFs can act inappropriately to attempt to gain respect from other people. I believe in their biggest strength lies their biggest weakness. In their incredible emotions and subconscious lives they are capable of tremendous acts and words of good will or just the opposite. As one gets older, one learns to take some of the negative aspects of life and shrug them off more. What I mean by this is that it is a fact of life everyone has weaknesses. But in overcoming our weaknesses we create our greatest strengths. When you get older you will interpret the world differently for you, and will find it easier to let go, and harder at times too. Nothing I can say can ever make anyone go through this, it will happen on it's own course, whether you are a P or a J, this is something you can't force. You can try your best to let things go, and to try and forgive yourself and others. -- Anonymous
A26 The association of status-consciousness with ENFjs doesn't have any solid theoretical backing. It's rubbish, it's bunk, it's fodder and fluff, it's blather and bull. It's garbage, it's drivel, trash, tripe and cadswallop, blither and plither, nonsense and fiddle-faddle. Aha. Etc. -- Horace (ENFj)
A27 There are exceptions to everything: I am an ESFp, my sister is an ISTp and our greatest childhood hero was an ENFj pastor and leader of summer camps. We needed someone to show us the application of Christian teaching into practice then, and he was exactly the right person for this. She admired him more than I did, well she doesn't any more but still we have pleasant memories of the summer camps. It is possible, though, that if they'd come to a closer long-term interaction their conflict relation would have had a word to say. -- Ezis (ESFp)
A28 Here's where I am confused on this topic, like this enfj says, the relations combinations say these two dont mix. I'm confused as to whether I'm an enfp or an enfj...even the tests can't quite decide (although they unofficially conclude that i am enfp) but I dont see much of a difference between the two and I have pretty much all the aspects of both...my boyfriend is an Istp and I love his attitude, he's so opposite to me and keeps me in check if I get emotional or gushy - it really makes me tick. I generally click very well with the Istp type, i think they're great and I love their very opposite opinion and outlook of life to me yet the feeling that there's the underlying core that connects and makes sense, but I really do take on characteristics of an enfj....can anyone shed light on this? It's much confusing. -- Pennycat
A29 A26: Fe dominant like to be accepted by everyone. They like to be love by most and they are keen on the type of people they hangout with base on social status- popularity or in crowd, people that can make them look good. -- istp
A30 To say that Fe dominants have the priority of being loved and accepted by *everyone* is simply incorrect. Status-consciousness isn't related to Fe. Not even tangentially. Actually using this as a criterion for typing will lead to all sorts of mistypings and problems with the intertype relations theory. -- Anonymous
A31 First and foremost ISTp's see their feelings and emotions as a very private zone, "inner sanctum" and NEVER allow ANYONE to intrude this privacy, especially in a forced way. And ENFj's way to translate their emotions is considered by ISTP's as a forced way. And because ISTp's almost never give direct emotional feedback (too hard to express and verbalize even if very strong are really there), ENFj increase the emotional pressure as if it was not enough for ISTp already to get overloaded. The result is complete emotional disbalance inside ISTp that may lead to the physical attack even. ENFj's on the other side may think that ISTp's demonstratively disrespect their sincere emotions. Having said that I would notice that though I have no close ENFj friends, I have quiet few among my pals (like pub mates and such) and some of them are very interesting artistic persons but I prefer to admire them from the safe distance or in very precise "medical" doses. -- Anonymous
A32 One of my best friends is an ENFJ. It's not all about type. Maybe you just know an ISTP that dislikes you. -- Anonymous
A33 ISTP introspection of ENFJ avoidance. ISTPs avoid ENFJ because they prefer not to be emotionally overloaded, not because we hate ENFJ actions, but prefer not to experience life that way. Assumption: We are only human with limited working memory. Emotion thoughts: I think that emotions activate your brain fully, leading to more memorable moments(more vivid memories). An ENFJ individual chooses to interpret and experience emotionally. An ISTP chooses detachment. The apriority of detachment allows understanding, that might be delayed by processing of irrelevant information(emotions). Now if the true meaning in life is connections amongst people, the ISTPs are the ones missing out due to tendency to ignore feelings. Sorry I can't communicate my thoughts better, you might have to reread a few times to understand fully, and might come up with other possible conclusions. Also, I think ENFJs sometimes use their abilities to manipulate people's emotions in order to get what they want. Some ISTPs really don't like this and avoid people like this. Why? it is simpler to live by my own morals, and not think about others feelings. This leads to a weakness, and I prefer to protect that weakness by avoiding manipulative people. Bitter feelings easily remembered, and angry feelings can be hard to control, especially for someone used to repressing feeling emotions. I say this because I understand ISTPs can benefit from ENFJ, but we avoid ENFJ like the plague because they can be quite the connundrum. for your insight. -- istp
A34 A26 is classic example of ENFj. S/he says that it is rubbish, but provides no reasons for it being rubbish. The point of A26 is to ridicule the idea by calling it names, but provides nothing to disprove it's validity. This sort of thing is despicable to the ISTp and some other types, and is the sort of baseless hate mongering you see the ENFj do so often (for famous example look at how Hitler portrayed the Jews, managed to make everyone hate them without any actual facts of anything wrong with them-ie ENFj is bunk in his bunker) -- Quayside
A35 @a26: ouch :[ i guess that was too ENFj? okay, so i'll say something that actually matters, BESIDES the offense you've just given all EIE's around.:o i see where you're coming from... but the reason "Horace" said it was rubbish, is because they, in turn, believe something had no real "evidence." You are disregarding this. As for the way they steered away from diplomacy, and added redundant and seemingly pointless words expressing her frustration, perhaps a valid excuse for this behavior is in fact their personality type. But on the other hand, Quayside, you weren't exactly diplomatic with your statement either. You used attacking words, such as "baseless hate mongering". Your main intention of the post was to shoot the ENFj down... rather than ideally admitting constructive criticism in stead. Just a mere correction there. Or maybe my ENFj nature is showing? -- EIE
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