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Question #1176118037Monday, 9-Apr-2007
Category: ESFp ISTj Dating Advice
I am an ESFP girl and I want to date a ISTJ guy. I like ISTJs and most of the time I understand them perfectly. The problem is they are often such great gentlemen and do things "because it should be done so", that I can't tell interest in me from mere politeness. Three times I had a guy being really nice to me, cooking food for me and taking me for walks and then I discovered they did not care for me that much. Do you have any experience with ISTJs, and could you please give me any hints how to deal them? -- Ezis
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Your Answers: 1+
A1 The best sign I know of a male ISTJ's romantic interest in someone (I know because I could be one; I often test that way.) is his continued presence in your life. If he's merely being polite, he won't make any particular effort to be around you. If not, you can count on casually "bumping into him" at various times for no particular reason. When it comes time to move forward romantically, he might or might not make the first move. If he doesn't, that doesn't mean he's not interested. And who knows? he may appreciate it if you're a little bit aggressive. I always like it when pretty girls show an interest in me. -- Anonymous
A2 Ezis: Now I start to think that those guys were probably all ISFJs, so the question was pointless. But thanks for advice, it makes sense really, and it helped me to understand a lot and will probably help me yet -- Ezis
A3 Actually, I have been thinking about it a lot and now I think they were INTPs. And I had several INTPs behaving like you describe. Can it possibly be that you are an INTP? -- Ezis
A4 I am an ENFP, and as far as personalty type goes,I think I would like the following types best for mating. INTP, ISTP, INTJ, ENTP. Providing that we had a similiar upbringing and there is some passionate attraction and sexual chemistry. I usually know the first time I have sex with someone if it is reasonable good, It will usually get better. Although I am more attracted to thinking type males, sometimes they make me sick and I need the nurturance of a feeling male. But I do like feeling males also. I think I would prefer a man that was pretty much equal on the feeling/thinking peference. I wouldn't be happy with a strongly thinking male in the long run, the more thinking they are, the less compassionate they are and I would like one that measured equally on thinking feeling. -- Vanice
A5 Was this meant as an answer to a different question - ? -- Ezis
A6 @Ezis:"Was this meant as an answer to a different question - ?" I think it was just remotely about this topic. She read this thread, and wrote whatever popped in her mind, but what popped in her mind, wasn't a answer to your question."And I had several INTPs behaving like you describe. Can it possibly be that you are an INTP?" Maybe A1's answer applies to other introverted guys too. Or maybe A1 is really a ISTp, who have the same hidden agenda as INTp "to love", and therefore might behave similarily in dating situations as INTp's. Anyway it mostly applied to me, and I'm INTp. "Actually, I have been thinking about it a lot and now I think they were INTPs." Well, if they really were INTp's. I don't think that INTp would go that far just to be nice or polite. If INTp isn't interested, he is as cold as possible without seeming rude. But INTp might seem cold even if interested, that depends on the other person. INTp follows the other person on what's acceptable closeness, because INTp doesn't know. Also INTp doesn't want to reveal that they are interested, if there's a possibility that it's just one sided. I don't want women to be aggressive, just iniative or suggestive in a friendly way. ESFp girls are like that, but there's still one difficulty, it's hard to tell if they are just joking, or could the jokes be also be taken seriously. Based on my ISTj friends, only thing I can tell about politness towards girls, is that ISTj's are polite towards girls in very different way than INTp's. ISTj's are correct in their speech, they don't swear or tell dirty jokes to women, and try to follow manners of politeness that seem like they were taken from a rule book. But on the other hand, they "drool" after women and do embarassing stuff like that. INTp's are the opposite in this manner. I might swear and dirty jokes as much as always, and ignore tradional manners of politeness (the ones that don't seem logical). But I wouldn't be rude in any manner towards the girl. So ISTj males put women on a pedestal and (too) visibly show it. While INTp behaves like he's driving a hard bargain, the same strategy INTp's can use to get other things they want. You know when you go to buy a expensive house, it's not the wisest thing to say:'What a cool house! I'll pay anything!'. "then I discovered they did not care for me that much." How did you find this out? -- INTp guy
A7 Ezis here again - I have divided my response to two parts, so that its easier to read. - As to the ESFP joking, many thoughts come to my mind. I am afraid I cannot give you any advice as to when an ESFP is joking, but probably when you have known an ESFP girl longer, you will get to know her and understand her joking "system". I personally take my joking very seriously. I often think and express myself in jokes. I value imagination and finding crazy possibilities. (Once I understood a guy offering me milk with my lemonade (actually he meant coffee), so I thought Why not and poured milk in my orange lemonade. It was tasty.) Joking can also be a way of easying the atmosphere, of expressing my thoughts, of showing affection. As I am friendly and sometimes afraid of being straightforward, I do not express my opinions by simple sentences like "I like you" or "I have a different opinion". I have it, but do not want to offend anyone with it and take the opportunity to express it and make good fun all in one sentence. ESFP are great creators of the films which, while watching them, you laugh all the time, but when leaving the cinema you realize that there was a serious message, too. A mature female ESFP is friendly to everyone, she may also be eager to make fun of everyone and everything, but also well aware of which people are worth her attention and joking. Then she usually expresses their affection to these people also by other means. All in all, everything needs time. - Btw, I like making fun of INTPs because they are so critical and serious. But thats also because I like them, cause they think independently, they are logical and inventive, they see everyone as a personality, they allow me free space. So I think if you happened to be embarrassed by ESFp joking, you neednt be. -- Ezis
A8 INTP guy, thank you a lot for your response. Most of it really strikes a chord with me, for example "INTP follows the other person on whats acceptable closeness." Yeah, thats what I have noticed several times. And I like your description of INTP behaviour much more than that of ISTJ. How did I find out? Well, there was a guy whom I was in love with, that visited two university courses that were not in his curriculum and everyone was telling me he is doing it just because of me. Then I saw him flirting with someone else twice. But just now I start to think that this was because I did not show enough interest. There was also a Japanese guy who was very friendly to me, cooked food for me and listened when I played the piano, and then it turned out that he had a girlfriend. Thats not so important, maybe that is some aspect of Japanese culture I dont understand. But there was a different friend of mine (Finnish this time), who was much more than just a friend, cause we were very close and he would invite me to theatre, cinema and for walks. I thought he liked me, but then suddenly he decided to go back to Finland for good. I can understand this, cause I know how its difficult to live in a foreign country, but still somehow makes me think that he did not care for me. But all in all, maybe it is more a problem of him living in a foreign country and also my behaviour, not so much a problem of his being an INTP. -- Ezis
A9 @Ezis: Yeah I think, that made me understand better. "I personally take my joking very seriously. I often think and express myself in jokes." That's quite similar with me. I often tell jokes about stuff I'm actually serious about, but just don't want to reveal it. And sometimes I answer with a joke, to avoid giving a real answer. But sometimes, jokes are just jokes. "Well, there was a guy whom I was in love with, that visited two university courses that were not in his curriculum and everyone was telling me he is doing it just because of me." This sounds very much like something INTp would do. "Then I saw him flirting with someone else twice. But just now I start to think that this was because I did not show enough interest." Oh, that doesn't mean he has lost his interest in you, or that he is actually more interested about that other girl. INTp can like many girls at the same time, but it's not until he knows the other person loves him, that he will allow himself to love that person. After that he will lose interest in anyone else. That Japanese guys motivations seem too strange to me, he probably isn't INTp. It would also be quite rare, that male INTp likes to cook. If that Finnish guy was INTp, he probably did care about you, INTp will almost always choose the option that's wiser in the long term over a emotional one. But he might not have been INTp, because I'm also Finnish, and even Finnish extroverts might seem introverted by foreign standards. Although the norm of behaviour is far from that of INTp's. So typing Finnish people could be more difficult to foreigners. -- Poster of A6
A10 Wow, an interesting coincidence really You made me think a lot. It is highly probable that he was an ENTP, which would explain a lot. Btw, if you happened to have any questions about ESFPs, just ask. -- Ezis
A11 A9 is way off. As an INTP I can assure you our kind often loves madly and deeply even if we don't know where we stand or have a chance. Thing is, we often hide it. But what seemed like a fleeting few encounters to some people can leave us in agony for up to years wanting more, depending on how special that someone is. It sounds great in theory that we'd always choose wiser options ... yet if a person fits my ideal enough my emotions win and even override more seemingly "sensible" deterrants. -- Anonymous
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